Comments on: Kings jump into the Nash rumors

By: Steven_Leafs

Steven_Leafs — Mon, 20 Feb 2012 22:06:28 +0000

I don't really have a preference either way, if I had to choose I would pick Johnson but even if Edler is the better player, and even if CLB believes Edler is the better player, I still think they would prefer to have Bernier/Johnson over Schneider/Edler.

Lets say for arguments sake that these were the offers:

Bernier/Johnson/2012 1st/2013 1st
for:
Nash/Sanford

Schneider/Edler/2012 1st/2013 1st
for:
Nash/Sanford

The LA package would win this deal hands down IMO (while assuming that the picks have completely equal value, pretend it is the same picks if you must).

Bernier can be argued as the better goalie, while so can Schneider, Bernier is 3 years younger and has one more year on his contract before becoming a RFA (which makes him cheaper). If both goalies do not want to stay in Columbus, then Schneider can sign a short term deal and force a trade or leave to Free Agency while Bernier must play out his extra year, then sign to a deal that is at least 2 years longer than Schneider would have to sign before Bernier can leave to Free Agency.

The same problem exists with Edler. He has only 1 year left on his deal, if he does not like Columbus then he can leave to Free Agency. Johnson on the other hand has 6 years left on his deal. Columbus gets similar players talent wise for much longer from LA than they would from VAN.

These 2 points are why even if everyone though Schneider and Edler were better than Bernier and Johnson Columbus would take LA's deal way before Vancouvers.

By: TimTheBone

TimTheBone — Mon, 20 Feb 2012 21:48:40 +0000

i respect that as your view on edler over johnson…. im simply refuting the fact that i don't believe one way or the other… than one is far better than the other…. I like johnsons game.. he's that mean type of defenseman that likes playing on or near that line…. edler still plays a fairly physical game but doesnt have the mean streak like johnson… i like that in JJ,,, i think his defensive deficiencies can be shored up under the proper conditions…. While edler may be a better player overall and yes very valuable to vancouver (and its not as if van has the def prospects coming up the ranks) i think i'd take johnson and that package over a schnieder/edler package

By: reinjosh

reinjosh — Mon, 20 Feb 2012 21:14:10 +0000

He's just a more complete player. Johnson struggles retardedly with defense. Even in a year when Quick could probably be a vezina candidate, Johnson is the worst minus player on his team.

And he plays number 1 on one of the best teams in the league. That is a pretty big indication of his value to them.

The only thing Johnson might have on Edler is offense and I don't think he can even claim that. Edler has a career average of .48 PPG and Johnson has .36.

Johnson is probably one of the most overrated dman in the league. He gets offensive starts far more than Edler does and he's still terrible defensively.

I just don't think Johnson could be claimed to be a better player than Johnson.

By: TimTheBone

TimTheBone — Mon, 20 Feb 2012 20:40:47 +0000

eehhnnn….. i'm just not sold on that thought of edler being quite a bit better…. I can definitely see your argument for edler over johnson but not for being vastly better…. edler is maybe only slightly better offensively at best…. Edler matured as a player quicker than johnson…. and i dont think its incompetance defensively as it is luongo stopping more pucks and having a team thats stronger overall…. sure i've seen johnson make some glaring mistakes… but Ive seen some douzies made by Edler as well.. he actually frustrated me early in his career.. i picked him up in a fantasy pool and he did not live up to my expectations… i'm just more of a fan of johnsons style…. and i don't think either is lots ahead of the other significantly enough

By: LeafsFTW17

LeafsFTW17 — Mon, 20 Feb 2012 20:28:40 +0000

I agree with Reinjosh, Edler is quite a bit better than Jack Johnson. Not only is his offensive game slightly better but he isn't incompitant defensivly like Johnson is..

Schneider + Edler > Bernier + Johnson. (Bernier is still a great goalie)

Though there is no way the Canucks give up Schneider or Edler, atleast not until the summer.

LA is the front runner in this forsure.

By: TimTheBone

TimTheBone — Mon, 20 Feb 2012 19:51:56 +0000

well first… edler doesnt qualify as a number one d-man…. i'm sorry but he's just not…they may play him as top pairing but that doesnt make him a number one… and your statement of edler edging johnson by a fair bit doesnt make sense to me… i'd be fine with you having an opinion of edler being the better d-man and the one you would choose… but i dont see how he clears JJ by "a fair bit"….. basically the same age.. Edler has JJ in size slightly… edler has played about 1/4 of a season more …. edler has more career points sure but recently they are both generally equal point producers since both have finally matured…. JJ has the meaner streak in him… Edler has been on the stronger team so the +/- is relative to each situation…. basically what i'm trying to say is they are very similar players with similar output.. saying one is leaps ahead of the other isn't fair to me… its more a matter of opinion who you like more and if you think they'd fit into your team better…. aside from that we're on the same page…. youre in the area of thinking that edler/schnieder is a better duo then johnson/bernier and im the opposite…. i like bernier over schnieder and johnson over edler… thats just me…i just cant see how edler is leaps ahead of johnson

By: reinjosh

reinjosh — Mon, 20 Feb 2012 19:19:26 +0000

And none of those teams should be willing to overpay. They don't have the need like LA does. In facto none of those teams have a need for Nash period.

By: reinjosh

reinjosh — Mon, 20 Feb 2012 19:18:13 +0000

No chance does Johnson/Bernier beat Schneider/Edler.

Edler is a number 1 dman. Johnson will never be one of those. Edler already is. Schneider and Bernier are a wash in my mind, maybe Bernier has the plus but Edler clears Johnson by a fair bit.

And I doubt Vancouver would offer Edler. Losing him and gaining Nash would actually hurt them more than help.

I'm cool with not giving up anything for Nash. At this point I'd prefer Carter.

LA has the best shot in my mind. They have the need and they have the pieces to get Nash. No other team in my mind that might have the assets CBJ would want has a need to go after Nash. He's not a fit in TO, NYR, VAN, Philly. None of those teams get anywhere adding him.

LA does. The scoring help would be immense and they can afford to give up Johnson with Doughty ahead of him and Voynov behind him. Plus with Quick they can give up Bernier.

LA is the only rumored team that should be taking a run at Nash. They are the only ones that make sense in my mind.

By: Steven_Leafs

Steven_Leafs — Mon, 20 Feb 2012 18:53:17 +0000

agreed.

By: TimTheBone

TimTheBone — Mon, 20 Feb 2012 18:19:21 +0000

Absolutely,… those offers even as an overpayment arent totally in CBJ long term favor…. I think any deal CBJ look for includes a solid goaltender… to me everything else is eliminated… so cut NYR….. I'm Sure CBJ wouldn't be sold on the Schenn deal.. I think they are looking for a different style d-man…. maybe not a pure offensive guy but not the stay at home type either…. I feel like its pretty clearly an LA and Van City race…. with LA edging it out with the better deal…