Oilers not cost-effective: Forbes

EDMONTON – At a cost of $1.71 million a victory, the Edmonton Oilers top the list of least cost-effective NHL teams that didn’t make the post-season.

Additionally, Forbes.comcontributor Dr. Patrick Rishe lists the Oilers as the worst-managed NHL team over the last five years.

Rishe, an associate professor of economics at Webster University in St. Louis and director of Sportsimpacts, said on Tuesday that he started crunching numbers after listening to a discussion on ESPN’s Mike and Mike in the Morning.

The gist of that discussion revolved around which franchise was the worst in pro sports. Rishe subsequently came up with two Sports Money blog entries that were posted on Forbes’ website over the last two days. One was titled the Most and Least Efficient NBA and NHL teams for the 2009-10 Season; the other was dubbed the Worst Managed Pro Sports Franchises of the Last 5 Years.

In both instances, he employed a formula of payroll cost per win. He took the number of points each team finished with after 82 games, then divided it by two. Two is the number of points awarded for a win.

Arguably, his numbers are not exact because of the overtime points in the NHL, but the Oilers, for example, eked out just 27 wins, so in theory their cost per win is even higher than $1.71 million.

“I used a wins-equivalent measure because hockey has ties. I wanted to try and make the comparison as uniform as possible to other sports and do that, you just look at wins,” Rishe said when he was reached in St. Louis.

“I think less important are the numbers for this past year and more important are the numbers that looked at the five-year analysis.”

The Oilers, Los Angeles Kings and Toronto Maple Leafs were at the top of the NHL list for the worst-managed franchises over the last five years, although not one of the three teams made its way into the top 10 list for pro sport franchises.

Read more: http://www.edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/edmonton-oilers/Oilers+cost+effective+Forbes/3071618/story.html#ixzz0pW2tKCYU


25 Responses to Oilers not cost-effective: Forbes

  1. hockeylegend488 says:

    one bad season and he says this. look at man games lost to injury in here. i know it sounds like were making excuses but honestly least we made the cup final in the last 30 years unlike the leafs. and while were at it worst managed teams least we didnt give away a second overall pick and another simular one for one player, thats bad management.

    I also agree edmonton had terrible management and poor steve tambellini is behind the 8 ball but so was burke. and for all the messier haters out there coulda been worse if keven lowe was canadas main pig haha

  2. cam7777 says:

    Ha, "gave away" those picks for a guy who will probably score 50 goals.  how many 50 goal scorers are there in the league?  Maybe 2-3 per year if we are lucky.  Give it a rest bud.  Direct quote from the head of central scouting – "if Kessel were available in this year's draft he would be the hands down first overall pick."  I understand it's possible the Leafs lose that trade, but we are years away from knowing the true outcome of that.

    I think the Oilers cup run was pretty flukey by the way, as evidenced by their total shitshow since then.  And how about all the horrendous contracts?  Horcoff for 6 years at 5.5 million?  Souray for another 2 at 5.4?  Khabbibullin for another 2 at 3.75?  Nilsson, Moreau and Pisani making upwards of 2 million for nothing?  How about trading Ryan Smyth for 2 million?  What about all the picks given up for Dustin Penner?  Need I go on.  At least the Leafs have been making strides in the long term goals department since about 2008.  The Oilers are still on a pretty steep decline. 

    You better hope Kevin Lowe isn't helping with the Cogliano/Gagner resigns, or they'll be locked up to matchin 7 yeaar 50 million dollar contracts by July 1st.

  3. reinjosh says:

    Where is that quote from? I would love to use that to prove how idiotic some friends of mine are.

  4. DandoEagle says:

    Uhmm wasn't Phil supposed to be the "hands down #1 pick in his draft year?" but wasn't.

    Kessel is fine I just don't get the jizz in the pants vver a potential 50 goal man – there are 300+ players who could score 50 goals when he does score 50 then start gloating.

  5. cam7777 says:

    Name them.

  6. cam7777 says:

    http://mapleleafshotstove.com/2009/10/26/q-a-with-nacs-chief-scout-mark-seidel/ 

    In terms of on-ice talent, there isn’t a player in this draft that comes close to what Phil can do with the puck

    He goes on to say that it has always been the character question marks that have dogged Phil and kept him from being the number one selection in his own draft.  Personally I think that most of that is a creation of the Canadian media, but if there's any truth to it, Burke will straighten it out.

  7. hockeylegend488 says:

    yeah theres bad contracts in the oilers for sure, but they end, and the prospect pool there is way deeper (and will continue to stock pile) . give it 3-4 years the oilers will be contending for playoffs at the leats wont be a 10 year plan eiher

  8. cam7777 says:

    the oilers have three prospects, none of which are even NHL calibre as of this moment. 

    hall, eberle, and mps

    vs.

    kadri, schenn, bozak, gustavsson, stalberg, d'amigo, caputi, blacker, paradis, aulie, reimer

  9. cam7777 says:

    not to mention rynnas and scrivens, two immensely talented goaltenders we signed for free.  rynnas is a rinne replica and scrivens is the best ncaa goalie since miller.  that also discludes whoever we get for kaberle.  the leafs have one of the top five prospect pools in the league now, and burke will only be expanding on it.

    i know you have 3 whole decent prospects, but let's scale back our ridiculously biased statements just a little bit.  eberle is an overhyped undersized wiener.  the guy has been in junior for 4 years while all of his peers made the jump to the pros – no friggin' wonder he's lighting that league up. hall will be great no doubt, but kadri has kept pace with him in their junior careers.  mps is a wild card, as we never know how europeans are going to adjust to the game over here, or how long it will take them.

  10. albertateams says:

    Yeah except Schenn, Bozak, Gustavson, and Stalberg are all roster players for the leafs.

    So if you want to include them then include Gagner, Cogliano, Brule, Dubnyk for the Oilers.

    Also d'amigo, caputi, blacker, paradis, aulie and reimer are very comparable to Peckham, Chorney, Nash, Omark, Rajala, and Roy. Maybe a slight edge to the TO prospects but out of both groups there is probably only a few that will develop into full time NHLers and I don't think there is oneplayer in either group that is top line, first d pair or starting goalie.

    so if you want to compare elite prospects its more like:

    Hall, Eberle, MPS

    vs.

    Kadri

    As for the Oilers prospects not being NHL caliber as of this moment they are every bit as close as Kadri. Most experts think Hall is in the NHl next year, Eberle and MPS both played very well at the Worlds against nhl players. Its very conceivable that all three play for the oilers next season.

  11. albertateams says:

    The leafs might have a top 10 prospect pool but not top five, Kings, Predators, Blues, Bruins, columbus, washington, Atlanta are all deeper.

    The leafs have some good young players but most of them aren't really prospects any more they are roster players. Its not a bad thing but Gustavson, schenn, bozak gunnerson, stalberg are roster players not prospects.

    Eberle I think is going to surprise a lot of people in the NHL, he could develop into a St. Louis type player.

    Hall is a much greater natural talent than Kadri, I really don't think at this point its even that debatable.

    MPS was great at the worlds the kid flat out can fly. Hes probablly the least likely to be in the NHL next year but on talent he is right there with Kadri and Eberle.

     

  12. albertateams says:

    Nice try with the hands down he would be the number 1 pick in this years draft. Here is the whole question and response:
    Q – Here’s an interesting question from one our readers, and one that you were probably expecting at some point. Where would a player of Phil Kessel’s talent and projection rank in this year’s draft class? A –  Kessel’s talent has never been an issue in the eyes of any scout, but the off-ice question marks have been following him for a long time since his time in the NCAA and even at the World Juniors. In terms of on-ice talent, there isn’t a player in this draft that comes close to what Phil can do with the puck. Definitely the consensus 1st overall pick if that were the only criteria. However,  factoring in some of those off-ice concerns, you would probably see him being taken at #4 overall in this draft, just a notch under the likes of Seguin, Hall and Fowler. If the Leafs are confident that they can get those question marks resolved, then they’ve got themselves a tremendous player.If you read the whole quote he has Kessel at #4 if he went in this draft. You can't just take a part of a quote and spin it out of context. You lose all credibility when you start spinning facts that just aren't there.

  13. leafmeister says:

    MSP has potential, but to me, he looks like the kind of guy who will skate circles around the defense, but fire a floater at the goalies mid-section. He does not have that god given ability to score. He has the Kessel speed, but not the killer instict that Kessel has.

    Eberle may become good, but its not going to surprise anyone. After his WJC performance he is being hailed as the second coming, we will see how he deals with expectations.

    No one is going to argue with you when you say that Hall has more natural ability than Kadri, but I think it is also hard to deny that Kadri out works Hall.

    It could come down to a Mike Richards vs. Ilya Kovalchuk debate. Now I dont think Kadri will be as good as Richards, nor will Hall be as good as Kovalchuk, but the work ethic vs. god given ability is comparable. For me, I would much rather have Richards as he is the heart and soul type player that is needed to win. Others may differ.

  14. cam7777 says:

    ha, yea, except bozak and stalberg have played about 30 games, so they’re still technically prospects. even if you include them, i’d take them over cogliano and gagner every day. gustavsson over dubnyk times 100.

    your “analysis” also doesn’t account for the fact that kessel just turned 22, and schenn is younger than eberle. who gives a crap if eberle is labelled a prospect, schenn is already a full time nhl defensemen at age 20. it’s possible eberle never makes the leap to the big leagues. eberle also did not play very well at the worlds. he put up some points at the end of a complete rout against a team that some 14 year old canadian girls would have beaten – congrats.

    Young core in Toronto:

    Phaneuf (24), Kessel (22), Kadri (19), Schenn (20), Kulemin (23), Bozak (23), Stalberg (23), Hanson (23), Gunnarsson (23), Gustavsson (25 – but he’s a goalie).

    Young core in Edmonton:

    Cogliano (24), Gagner (21), Hall (18), MPS (19), Eberle (20)

    Umm, I’ll go with Toronto.

  15. cam7777 says:

    Ha, how is not debatable?  After the first month of the season, Kadri outscored Hall in OHL.  It wasn't enough to catch him, but for five months he outscored him consistently and made up major ground despite Hall being on the most stacked team in the league and Kadri making due with a far lesser team.  Then it took Hall 2 extra series (one of them 7 games) to catch Kadri's playoff scoring mark.  Sorry pal, but you need to stop believing all the TSN hype.

    Bozak and Stalberg played 30 games – they are still prospects.  Gustavsson is also very much still a prospect.  If Schneider is a prospect then so is Gustavsson.   HF rated the Leafs 6th best talent pool in the league, and that was without Caputi, Rynnas and Scrivens.  Add in a Kaberle trade, and wait for Burke to nab us a pick or two at the draft, and we're rolling.

  16. cam7777 says:

    How is it out of context? I explained clearly and succinctly that he went on to say that character issues have always dogged phil kessel.  my point was that he is hands down the most talented guy if he were in this pool.  i think it is you that wants to spin the latter half of the quote to suit your own needs.  Way to completely ignore the explanation though, just read the bits that interest you.

  17. leafmeister says:

    Plus Gagner has made no progress, arguably going backwards, in 3 years, and Cogliano has fallen off of the charts.

    Add to Toronto whatever Burke gets for Kaberle, and the Leafs have an even better core.

  18. albertateams says:

    Theres not a GM in the league that would trade Hall for Kadri. Until one or both prove something in the nhl its not even debatable who is more highly souht after and has more raw talent. As they develop things could change, but as of right now Hall is more talented and more valuable than Kadri. Your blue and white biased is in full swing and its clouding your judgement. Use common sense. No one would trade Hall for Kadri.

    Bozak and Stalberg are still technically prospects due to lack of games but they will be on the leafs roster next year and they are also 24 years old which is getting up there as far as age for prospects.
    HF has them at six and thats with top 4 prospects for the leafs being roster players at the end of the year. Look at the depth of some of the other teams prospects that have played only a handfull of games in the nhl or none. A lot of teams are going to add prospects at the draft. The Bruins are going to add a ton of depth to an already solid prospect pool.
  19. DandoEagle says:

    Cam any player in the NHL could score 50 goals for petes sake! 

    Thats my point of the "300+ guys could be 50 goal men"
    I'm not saying it's possible but there's potential aeverywhere!
  20. reinjosh says:

    What makes Hall the more talented player? Because the media says so? I'm not debating who is (im sure you know my answer) but show me why I'm wrong.

  21. albertateams says:

    There is no GM in the league that would trade Hall for Kadri. I'm not saying Kadri isn't good I think he will be a solid player, but Hall could be something really special. 

  22. albertateams says:

    I wasn't comparing rosters hands down right now TO has the better roster. The point was you can't include full time NHLers like Schenn and other young players as prospects any more. I guess where we differ is on when a player is no longer a prospect. I think once they have established a role on the big club he is no longer a prospect. Take PK in Montreal, I wouldn't consider him a prospect, he has established himself as a nhl dman and there is no way hes heading back to the minors.

    Even if you want to include Bozak and Stalberg with kadri as prospects. I still take MPS, Eberle and Hall over those three.
  23. albertateams says:

    This is what you said:

    "Direct quote from the head of central scouting – "if Kessel were available in this year's draft he would be the hands down first overall pick."  I understand it's possible the Leafs lose that trade, but we are years away from knowing the true outcome of that."

    This is what the actual quote said:

    In terms of on-ice talent, there isn’t a player in this draft that comes close to what Phil can do with the puck. Definitely the consensus 1st overall pick if that were the only criteria. However,  factoring in some of those off-ice concerns, you would probably see him being taken at #4 overall in this draft, just a notch under the likes of Seguin, Hall and Fowler. If the Leafs are confident that they can get those question marks resolved, then they’ve got themselves a tremendous player.

    You didn't say that in your regional post  you posted a direct quote that was no where near what he said. When drafting players teams evaluate the whole package not just the players skill with the puck. Phil is a great player I'm not arguing that but you need to be more careful in saying something is a direct quote when it is clearly not.

  24. albertateams says:

    I don't know about that he looked pretty good at the worlds, his shot isn't bad at all but he really drives the net well so hes going to the tough places to get goals which is great, hes also a good passer. He is also a good size at 6'1 200, It will be interesting to see how his game translates to the NHL. There is more risk with European  skaters.

    There is a lot of people out their saying Eberles game will not translate well in the NHL, I don't think thats the case.

    I don't know if out works is the right way to put it but maybe he has some intangibles/grit that Hall doesn't have currently.

    I agree on Richards over Kovy, but Hall is much closer to Kovy than Richards is Kadri right now. It will take years to see who will be the better NHL player as prospects always have uncertainty but right now Hall has more value than Kadri.

  25. albertateams says:

    Gagner will have a break out year in the next 2 years, he just needs a little better talent and a better environment and he will be fine.

    I wouldn't say Cogliano has fallen off the charts however I do think he will be traded. The Oilers didn't handle his situation right with the Heatley trade and other trade rumors. They will still be able to get a good return for him.

    In terms of adding prospects from Kaberle, yes it will increase depth but I doubt they trade Kaberle for prospects and picks that are unproven. I think it would be too big of a gamble they have to get at least one proven NHLer. Even if they did go with draft picks it essentially would get back a 1st and 2nd. Which they don't have. As such they are only adding what a lot of teams will be adding at the draft with thier own picks.

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