Sens losing money?

Up here in Canada I think the game will be fine although the article I read that said the Sens will lose 10 million this year before the puck is even dropped and that they were at the maximum that they can spend kind of concerns me. I don’t know if its a new way to try to sell more tickets since they would not be able to sign Chara and Redden or have to deal players earlier then expected.

Team president and CEO Roy Mlaker said in an Ottawa Sun article:

“That’s 10 million (Senators owner) Mr. (Eugene) Melnyk will lose before we even drop the puck,” Mlaker said. “The key is we have to find out how we can enhance revenues.”

“People think we have lots of room under the (salary) cap,” he said. “We have absolutely no room.”

When I see that I wonder how Muckler could have asked Hossa, Chara and Redden if they could agree to the same amount for all of them as Muckler was quoted in the Ottawa Sun:

“Earlier in the summer we went to three players — Wade Redden, Zdeno Chara and Marian Hossa — and we proposed that we were going to try to get all three players signed at the same price,” said Muckler. “Two of the players were willing to buy into the plan and third — which was Hossa — was not. After that, we knew we had a problem and that came about the time (Atlanta GM) Don Waddell called (about Dany Heatley). We kept trying to get Hossa signed, but eventually we had to make a decision to move on.”

I don’t really know what to think about that since Roy Mlaker and Muckler seem to both send a different message to the fans unless the Sens budget has change since they acquired Dany Heatley but I find it kind of strange

What do you think?

Sources: Ottawa Sun

For the Muckler comments:

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL/Ottawa/2005/08/25/1187591-sun.html

For the Roy Mlaker comments:

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL/Ottawa/2005/09/16/1219974-sun.html


44 Responses to Sens losing money?

  1. movingfire says:

    who cares….I am sick of money talk…lets play hockey….

  2. Jesus_Piece says:

    I think if you can’t exist under this cap now, you shouldn’t exist at all. Would be bad to lose another Canadian team, but this is becoming a joke now. All the parameters are in place now, there is no reason a team, especially in Canada, should be in the black on a consistent basis. I think every team should get their shit together.

  3. muckies says:

    i am a huge Sens fan and brew up in Ottawa, but if they can’t make money OR DON”T SHUT UP ABOUT MONEY THEN MOVE THE *****ING FRANCHISE TO WINNEPEG…..

    If they are losing money, THEN WHY DID THEY TRADE FPR A PLYER THEY HAVE TO PAY $4.5 MILLION TO, AND WHY ARE THEY TALKING ABOUT SIGNING REDDEN AND CHARA???????????

    Trade the entire goddam team and become an AHL Franchise,

    BITE ME MLAKAR, BITE ME MELNYK.

    GO AWAY AND LET ME ENJOY MY HOCKEY TEAM!

  4. NemiNA says:

    Heres what the sens should do.

    Jack up ticket prices by about 10 bucks, and lower concession prices. Here’s why:

    We Americans are fat and would eat anything. (NOT ME! I’m a statue of physical perfection). So that means Canadians laugh at us and they don’t eat as many nachos. So lesser food cost would make sense. Canadians won’t pay 30 bucks for a small pizza when they probably just ate before the game, so lower concession would be smarter.

    Then they should start winning games to bring in more butts to fill the seats. Then they should increase the fan giveaways.

    It would never work cause people don’t want to pay higher ticket prices, thats their problem in the first place.

    What Ottawa REALLY needs to do is keep all the bad headlines about Heatley out of the Ottawa media. The less people are excited about Heatley, the less they would want to see a game.

    The should also market the hell out of their Rivalry with Toronto. They will play 8 times this year, and that would be great for ticlet sales.

  5. jarcpitre says:

    They were one of the main teams to get this thing going about the salary cap. Now they are saying they are going to loose money before the season starts. I wonder what kinda scam this team is pulling? I would honestly see the team getted audited and lets see where the money really goes. I honestly to buy into this loosing money before the season even starts, it just doesn’t make sence

  6. jarcpitre says:

    They were one of the main teams to get this thing going about the salary cap. Now they are saying they are going to loose money before the season even starts. I wonder what kinda scam this team is pulling? I would honestly like to see the team get audited and lets see where the money really goes. I honestly dont buy into this loosing money before the season even starts, it just doesn’t make sence

  7. Tweek says:

    This dosnt surprise me because hockey in ottawa is a tough sell. The market is growing but it is still one of the smallest in the league and the revenue generated from business was hurt when Kanata’s tech industry hit the skeds. The sens have pretty good attendence but more money can be made in other places but its been tough because there is a good crop of people in Ottawa who have been lifelong habs and leafs fans who didnt catch on to the sens when they came into existence. Most sens fans who would like to put the money into the team are usually younger, give a market like Ottawa another 10 years and youll see those people spending a lot more money on the sens therefore increasing their revenue streams, until then Ottawa will have a tough time making money, breaking even should be their goal in the short term.

  8. Tweek says:

    They already market the hell out of the Toronto rivalry. Ticket prices at at their peak when the leafs roll into town in the hate train leaves the station on every media outlet in Ottawa. There is no possibly way to hype the leafs coming to Ottawa and on top of that there are usually at least 8000 Toronto fans in the building on game night so the ability for restaurants and hotels to make more money is there as well.

  9. titans says:

    I thought the dollar and the Canadian Peso or whatever the hell it is were much closer in value recently. Now I’m no economist (obviously) but shouldn’t that help the Canadian teams a little?

  10. titans says:

    I work for the ARAMARK corp. (the company that does concessions for most NHL teams) and let me assure you that will NEVER happen. When it costs you NINE CENTS for a soda you can sell for $4.50 you ain’t doin nothing to rock that boat!!

  11. Ace_Bailey says:

    I’m sure if they make the playoffs they can make most of their money back, but to what extent? I mean, how much of a profit will they turn out?

    I don’t understand teams like this. They could go all the way up to the cap ceiling but they still don’t have the funds to cover it. Why don’t more teams spend in the middle on a floating basis? This makes absolutly no sense to me why teams in a difficult financial situation would spend to the cap ceiling.

  12. dcz28 says:

    Here is what Eugene Melnyk had to say in the Ottawa sun today:

    “If you could, you’d like to be able to keep all of your players,” said Melnyk. “I’m committed to the long term with this team. I want to have a team that is successful and competitive.

    “I have no interest in owning a team that’s going through the brutality of a losing season. I wouldn’t accept it and I don’t think the fans in Ottawa would accept it either. I believe in the concept of a winning team.” he also said that they would try to sign Redden and Chara during the season but was not shure if they could keep both.

    He was also asked what’s bigger: Winning a Stanley Cup of beating the Leafs in the playoffs?

    his response: “Beating the Leafs would be great, but winning the Cup would mean a lot more,” said Melnyk. “Let’s face it, the rivalry with Toronto is fun for the fans.”

    With Melnyks comments it seems as though he won’t be losing much money or he does not care as much as long as the team wins…so it might has been a ploy to get fans to buy tickets by Roy Mlaker as people in Ottawa have had lots from him in the past

  13. movingfire says:

    lol……habs will beat the leafs by 8 points this year

  14. titans says:

    Oilers will beat both of em’!

  15. JannettyTheRocker says:

    Damn right…….GO OILERS GO!!!!

  16. JannettyTheRocker says:

    It’s called a dollar……We are Canadian, so it’s a dollar………..I believe a peso is from Mexico…………..And yes the dollar (canadian) is closer now to the US dollar…..The difference is that the Canadian teams pay a whole lot more taxes than the US teams. The American franchises get tons of tax breaks.

  17. NemiNA says:

    oh so your the one that waters down the beer.

    Do you work at the Wacho Center?

  18. dcz28 says:

    My guess is like the Melnyk comments i posted below…Melnyk wants a team that wins and he is prepared to lose money for a winning team just like Mike Ilitch in Detroit but the thing is they said tickets were selling good in Ottawa and better than the last season they played so if you listen to Muckler and Melnyk they seem to be fine but Mlaker seems to paint a different picture but he has always been like that

  19. AHLoldie says:

    Because if they don’t. they don’t have a chance. The players are still being overpaid in relation to what the teams make in revenue. In the last season played, 19 teams out of 30 lost money. 7 of the remaining 11 were at a break even level. The teams that made money did it mostly with TV revenue. Nobody can make 39 million with attendance alone. That’s why the large market teams can make a little profit. The cap never guaranteed that a team would make money, it only gave everybody a fighting chance to sign better players. So far only the pens and sens have come out and admitted their losses. Believe me, 26 additional teams are going to be in the red.

  20. Kraut182 says:

    I just don’t see how a team like Ottawa, in a strong Canadian market, can lose that much money. Nor do I see how a team like Pittsburgh will lose money even if they make the Finals, after having paid down significant debt in past low attendance, non-playoff seasons.

    The NHL needs to have an outside audit of these teams, and to release the numbers to players and fans so we can all see the truth (or lack thereof) in these claims.

  21. Marky2Fresh says:

    They don’t need to market the Leaf games, there are more Leaf fans in the place then Sen fans most of the time.

  22. Marky2Fresh says:

    The Leafs were top in the league in profit BEFORE the cap, they are going to make a killing now.

  23. dlo44 says:

    yeah well, the leafs will beat the habs by 9 points

    so there.

  24. dlo44 says:

    granted, the oilers improved a hell of a lot this year.

    but who is going to put the puck in the net?

    smyth cant carry the load himself

    and by the way who is the oilers goalie? (lol)

  25. Bishop7979 says:

    Why are people surprised that teams are going to lose money even under the cap? This was a sport that pre lockout had the majority of the teams bleeding revenue just to ice a competitive team.

    LA, St Louis, Detroit, Philly, Toronto all were teams that spent more money that just the team brought in. Many of these organizations owners have other sources of income and had no problem throwing that money into a hockey team for a chance to win.

    To say that Pittsburgh or Ottawa will, in the first year back from a year long lockout, lose 7 mil or 10 mil then I’m not shocked. Ticket prices have been lowered, many markets have taken a hit with fans, the CBA might have made it easier for team to ice a strong team, but it still hasnt fixed all the leagues problems yet.

  26. mojo19 says:

    If some teams lose money this year, the NHL said they are going to lower the cap for next year. Thanks a lot Pittsburgh and Ottawa. I think if the teams lose money, the cap shouldn’t be lowered but those cities should lose their teams.

  27. dcz28 says:

    Why should Ottawa lose their team when they lose money if the owner is ready to pay it out of his own pockets to ice a good team?

    Teams like Detroit and Philly will make money but maybe not as much as people think because you have to remember that they paid the players they bought out wich does not count against the cap but they still count it in their budget for this year… i know the Wings do because Holland said his players spending including the buyouts would put the player salaries this year close to 50 million so they will make money but how much depends on tv deals, fanbase ticket buyers, concessions and merchandise but i think the biggest reason that the cap will drop will be because of the tv deals not being as good so every team with maybe Toronto, Detroit, Rangers, Philly, Montreal and Colorado as the exceptions will not make a big profit

  28. mojo19 says:

    Ottawa can keep their team as long as the cap stays where it is. The poor teams shouldn’t hurt the rich teams so much, that was my point.

  29. dcz28 says:

    As a Wings fan i understand what you mean but i also think that if the cap is lowered it would be because of the tv deal being lower but at the same time i dont think they will lower it because so many teams would be screwed because most teams are already near the cap i think at worst it will stay the same for next year but that’s just my guess

  30. Bishop7979 says:

    the cap figure going up or down has nothing to do with Pittsburgh or Ottawa losing money. It has to do with league wide revenue. It has nothing to do with the profits or loses of single teams, it has to do with how much money is brought in period.

    the cap will always be based on a percentage of that number, if the amount of money the league brings in goes down, the cap number goes down to match it.

    This season the pens have already had a higher revenue figure than they did at the end of the last season, so they have done their part in producing revenue.

  31. Bishop7979 says:

    Pittsburghs repayment of debt has been going on since Mario took over the team. They basically had repayed the majority of their debt before the lockout began, it was one of the reasons that they were cutting their payroll each of the previous 3 seasons.

    The debt that had accured was well before mario bought the team, and he, and his ownership group, were unwilling to go lose large sums of money and not be able to repay any of the previous owners debt. Of course while looking for good press the team failed to clarify the fact that the debt repayment has been an ongoing process for the better part of 5 or more years.

    As far as why pittsburgh can lose money, its simple.

    1. Lowered ticket prices. Not everyteam is going to fleece their fans for 300 dollar tickets. The Pens felt they had priced their fans out of the building over the last couple years and have dropped their prices in hopes of bringing those fans back. The team has traditionally had one of the top 5 tv ratings against their population in the league, so the fan base is there, but a night of hockey for a family of 4 was too expensive for the typical fan to pay.

    2. Old building. The arena is one of the smallest and oldest in the league. They have basically sold out a good majority of the games before single game sales even began. There are not enought tickets to go around at this point. Plus the arena lacks the Luxuary boxes and Suites that modern facilities have that are the real money makers for a team.

    Given their current situation they basically have a cap on how much they revenue they can produce, and they have basically hit that cap.

    And besides, if they are willing to spend a couple million extra for a season or two then whats the problem anyways?

  32. NemiNA says:

    Yea. Bush and his big business. I didn’t vote for him.

  33. Miser says:

    Ever thought of being a reporter ?

    You missed the point of the article.

    When Mlakar was being interviewed, he said that the media et al are under a misconception that the Sens might spend to the cap.

    He said that the Sens were no where near it and had no intention of being a team near that level of spending.

    Especially because there is no more Canadian equalization payments and the Sens won’t be eligible for revenue-sharing.

  34. Mr_Canuck says:

    This is what i hate about the new cap, that teams don’t understand why it was put in place.

    It is not right for the Pens, to openly sign all these players saying they’re gonna lose money, just to make a run.

    It’s not right that there are several teams who maxed up their salaries just because they could get players they couldn’t get before

    Teams are still going to lose money in the new NHL even though the owners were given every opportunity to be smart with their money.

    Well done in Minnesota where lemaire didn’t want to sign new free agents ( big name) even though he has like 15 million in cap room. He is a smart Gm, and a smart Hockey man.

  35. Kraut182 says:

    Here was my theory Bishop:

    -team makes enough money to pay off debt … thus profitable hockey opperations and now no more debt.

    -team adds salary, but seems to add a comparable amount of ticket sales (may be slightly less, and now more so as I didn’t now they dropped prices). So these 2 items seem to cancel each other out (or come close).

    -So may be the team loses some money, but with a playoff run and added ticket sales there, I don’t see why the Pens wouldn’t make money or at the very least lose very little.

  36. Kraut182 says:

    Forbes lists the Wild as the 2nd most profitable franchise in the NHL last year at over $11 million. So is it smart GM or cheap owner?

  37. mojo19 says:

    supposing the cap does go down. I assume their will be another rollback in salaries that would equal the % the cap went down by.

    And Also, aren’t the league wide revenues taking into acount individual teams profits/losses ?

  38. dcz28 says:

    No i never thought about being a reporter and the point of the article was that the Sens will lose money and do not have more money to spend this year unless Melnyk wants to lose more money…the point about Canadian equalization and revenue sharing i can give you as i did not put it in but i took two articles just to show that somehow Muckler was going to re-sign Chara and Redden this summer and now

    for some reason they are not sure they can keep both

    That was the main point of my article to try and figure out why they can’t make the same offers to Redden and Chara now since they probably knew they

    would not have the revenue sharing or Canadian equalization after the CBA was signed…my guess is because Spezza and Havlat if they have good seasons

    will be looking for a raise thus making it since harder to sign both Redden and Chara since they already are losing money

    I’m not bashing you but if you could have wrote it better why didn’t you?

  39. Neely4Life says:

    its called in the red, black mean u make money

  40. Mr_Canuck says:

    Lemaire said he had the money to basically sign free agents, but would rather build from within.

    He’s a genius, but i’m surprised they only made 11 Million, Do you realize how many games in a row Minnesota sells out?

    Here’s a clue: Montreal didn’t sell out for their exhibition opener, Minnesota has already SOLD OUT for every pre-season game.

    Talk about a hockey city.. and Betman had taken their team away.. what does this mean?

    Winnipeg and Quebec need a team again!

  41. movingfire says:

    hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

  42. Miser says:

    True enough. However there isn’t a story here that hasn’t already been put forward many times. Let’s not forget that the Sens (or any team for that matter) cannot sign players, in the last year of their contract, to an extension before January. The signing of Chara and Redden are not dependent on if the Sens lose or make money but more directly to the cap (the league’s or the team’s budget).

    I am a “tad” cynical when it comes to reporting. Having to put up with the “Garriochs” of the world can do that.

    There is a lot more positives to deal with now that hockey is back, yet doom and gloom reporting prevails. It does make for better headlines and newspaper sales.

    Lastly, no offense taken, I was taken aback by many of the comments that followed your piece.

    As for writing, I have and do … just not very often here.

Leave a Reply