Comments on: Should The Habs And Flyers Make A Deal For Carey Price?

By: cam7777

cam7777 — Wed, 07 Apr 2010 14:30:41 +0000

He likely won't be able to if Price just waits long enough. Let's say for example, that Halak gets 4 million on a resign (I think he'll get the Hiller contract, closer to 4.5, but let's just say 4.0). And then Plekanec ends up costing about 4.5 (which again, is fairly conservative, as he might cost 5.5 given that Gionta got 5 to produce less, and Gomez makes 7.4). You're at the 53.2 million of the 57.7 cap already (including the Laraques buyout), and you have at least 8 roster players to sign:

Andrei Kostitsyn (3.25) - Scott Gomez (7.357) - Brian Gionta (5.0)
Mike Cammalleri (6.0) - Tomas Plekanec (4.5) - ________________
Travis Moen (1.5)

Andrei Markov (5.75) - Roman Hamrlik (5.5)
Jaroslav Spacek (3.833) - Hal Gill (2.25)
Josh Gorges (1.1) - Ryan O' Byrne (0.942)

P.K. Subban (0.875)

Jaroslav Halak (4.0)

If Price wants, he can simply wait until the Habs fill some of those spots. Once they're at the cap (which won't take long since they only have 4.5 million left (and probably realistically, closer to 3 million with the actual prices of Plekanec and Halak), someone could indeed swoop in and snatch Price away. Matching an offer sheet at that point would mean getting raped on some other trades. This is exactly what Chiarelli was faced with last year. Either lose Kessel, or move Bergeron, and at least one other for next to nothing (and even after giving him away, they still had to get rid of Kobasew). The only problem is, the Habs have no one of any interest to anyone. They've tried for a full year now to move the Kostitsyn's, and no one wants anything to do with Hamrlik's enormous salary.

On top of that, you still have some guys that will be fairly pricey to resign (ie. not 1 million or less) in Dominic Moore, Sergei Kostitsyn, and Benoit Pouliot. A lot will depend on what Price actually wants. If he wants to be a Hab, and get spat on every time he doesn't single-handedly win a game like Halak, then sure, he'll sign a lesser offer sheet to stay. But let me tell you, the Hawks have no need for late 1st round picks, but could really use a franchise goalie. Matching any offer sheet is simply hot air at this point.

By: lafleur10

lafleur10 — Wed, 07 Apr 2010 08:10:56 +0000

he'll match any offer no problem he said that himself,but worst caseif he doesn't we'll take the picks including the 1st rd picks that teams will have to give up?

interesting on patrick sharp though i'd take him too as a consulation prize if we didn't get carter
cam can you tell me how the compensation works if an offer sheet is given to price?
thanks

By: cam7777

cam7777 — Wed, 07 Apr 2010 06:02:27 +0000

Harding was just one example. Vokoun is also available. Roloson will probably be available if they want to do a short term option. And people tend to forget too, that Emery was lights out fantastic to open the season this year, and only when he got injured did he slow down, and eventually have to stop altogether for surgery. It would be a massive over-reaction to the problem to trade Carter for Price.

What they should do is trade for Corey Schneider, so they have a top notch youngster in the system, and then go out and get one of the other guys, either via a trade, or free agency, to help the team for another year or two. This way, if things go bad, you actually have someone to turn the team over to.

That being said, Elliote Friedman reported yesterday, that from what he hears, you can expect some pretty substantial changes to the cores of both the Bruins and the Flyers this off-season. Apparently, pockets of players with different agendas have surfaced, cliques if you will, and it has soured the locker-room in a significant way. Both teams can blame injury all they want, but the reality is that there was enough talent on both rosters to perform better. Point and case, should Carter's injury even be a big deal when your top six includes Simon Gagne, Mike Richards, Scott Hartnell, Daniel Briere, and two top notch youngsters in Claude Giroux and James VanRiemsdyk?

So you never know.

I suspect the Hawks will be in on Price very hard. Patrick Sharp could be a more realistic option. Habs are in cap hell, as nordiques points out below, so it's going to be tricky regardless. Better hope Price doesn't just hold out and get offer-sheeted when Gauthier can't match.....

By: lafleur10

lafleur10 — Tue, 06 Apr 2010 21:47:38 +0000

mojo the difference is though harding is no better than what they currently have acquiring harding is a side ways move it's not really improving them and harding doesn't increase there chances of winning price does! simply put he better than what available and will sigficantly improve them and their cjhances of winning and would gave them the kind of goaltending that they haven't had in a long,long time so ask your self this if you were paul holmgren which 1 of the 2 would you really like to have his job may depend on it?yeah for price it'll cost you more than harding but that's the price you pay for a chance to win and having an elite goaltender it's just my opinion mojo but i think holmgren will weigh his options and he will ultimatley decide that if he has to give up carter in a price deal we will do it i could be wrong i guess we'll just watch and see how it unfolds.

By: mojo19

mojo19 — Tue, 06 Apr 2010 13:55:21 +0000

But Lafleur, there are a lot of teams with goaltending upgrades for the Flyers. Let's say you're right, and the Habs say they want Carter for Price, but the Wild come out and offer up Harding for Hartnell. Now the Flyers can say would i rather have Hartnell and Price, or Carter and Harding. This is just one example, but there are lots of fits out there and different combo's, I don't think your feeling is right about the Flyers having to trade Carter for a goaltending upgrade.

By: nordiques100

nordiques100 — Tue, 06 Apr 2010 08:27:06 +0000

Habs have 13 mil in cap space with the cap going up to 57 plus.

Have the following under contract:

F: Gomez, Gionta, Cammellari, Moen, AKostitsyn, Pacioretty
D: Hamrlik, Spacek, Gorges, Markov, Gill, O'Byrne
G: none.

The Laraque buyout will be on the books.

They need to re-sign several free agents:
Plekanec - 5 mil per, but longer term to lessen cap burden
Halak - 3 mil per
Pouliot - 1 mil
Pyatt - 900K
Lapierre - 700K
Darche - 500K

All that, plus buyout should cost around 11 mil and leave 1.5 mil in cap space and they'd still need to sign Price and SKostitsyn plus fill 5 roster spots to round out a 22 man roster.

Sorry to say but the Habs are in cap heck. And the prices to Pleks and Halak are generous. They may get much more than that. Pleks could get 6 but that seems crazy. But then again, GMs like Slats are crazy.

They'll need to find takers I think for both Kostitsyns, Price and Hamrlik, free up some valuable cap and round out their roster.

Price and S Kostitsyn to Edm for Brule, Cogliano, Smid and Deslauriers

re-sign
Brule at 1.5 mil per
Cogliano at 1.5 mil per
Deslauriers at 1 mil per
Smid costs 1.3 mil

Oil get a number 1 goalie who may fit into their young team. Khabibulin may be done with a bad back. S Kost could fit well too with his former junior linemate Sam Gagner. Price is still in a tough hockey market, but may thrive as the for sure number 1, a veteran and much tougher management group and coaching staff and being back in western Canada.

The Habs get depth. Lots of depth and 4 players under age 25. A huge price for Edmonton but thats to counter the potential star power of Price and his potential.

I realize Hab fans would prefer a proven star for Price but their needs are thoroughly filled here will these additions. Brule is showing signs of being a top 2 line centre. Cogliano has the blazing speed that suits the habs well. Smid adds some grit and is still young and learning, Deslauriers is a decent young goalie prospect who'd fit nicely in a platoon with Halak. All 4 have lots of potential. Not Price potential but are good, young, affordable talents.

Thats 5.3 added but they dont have to worry about RFAs price and S Kost.

Trade Hamrlik to Col for Tom Preissing.

Bury Priessing and his 2.9 cap hit in the minors. Thats 5.5 mil off the books.

Trade Pacioretty to Van For Steve Bernier. Adds 2 mil but removes 900K from the cap.

Bernier is a bigger forward plus is french Canadian with a scoring touch. Should add a net presence. He needs the scenery change.

Trade A Kostitsyn to Phx for Petr Prucha and Brett MacLean. MacLean to the farm, Prucha adds 1.2 mil to the cap, but they subtract 3.2 off it. 2 mil in savings.

Prucha may be just as productive as Kost, but at a cheaper price.

Players coming in add 9.5 to the cap. Players out cost 9.6 mil. They'd still have about a mil and a half to round out their roster.

Pouliot-Gomez-Gionta
Prucha-Plekanec-Cammellari
Cogliano-Brule-Bernier
Pyatt-Lapierre-Moen

Markov-O'Byrne
Smid-Spacek
Gorges-Gill

Halak-Deslauriers

By: lafleur10

lafleur10 — Tue, 06 Apr 2010 07:40:21 +0000

gagne is done and he wouldn't fir our needs, carter is and that's what we should and can get for price if he was traded to the flyers,in trade talks philly almost has no bargaining power because of there desperate need of goaltending we hold all the cards because of the price ,halak tandem we have(which is the best tandem in the league) the flyers are also at a disadvantage with other teams that have goaltenders too because they need 1 and teams know that so it's either give up carter or no deal! even your leafs would have the advantage because you guys could "say well if it's bustavsson or giguere going to you it's carter coming the other way !

By: nordiques100

nordiques100 — Tue, 06 Apr 2010 07:08:44 +0000

Morrow could be the next Nuke Burnett. His stuff has the best potential to be ace worthy. But with his million dollar arm comes a 5 cent head and injuries. If he can stay healthy, the Jays could have like 3 number 2 guys : McGowan, Mar*****, Morrow.

Drabek though for sure is ace worthy. Hopefully they dont rush him.

2011 could see him in the rotation with the 3 M's and RR. That is a fairly deep staff. Rzepcynski is the next in line.

That could leave Stewart, Jenkins in AAA, Cecil and Mills in the bullpen with the buffet of crap of Downs, Tallet, Frasor, Camp, Eveland as the other bullpeners. If not Jenkins as closer, definitely Stewart and his live arm. He already is a 2 pitch pitcher. Let him and Cecil close. Thats what I would do. I mean the team needs their own version of Papelbon.

The lineup is pathetic. But in 2011 i would hope that we have a real leadoff hitter.

1. Leadoff guy preferably an outfielder
2. Hill 2B
3. Lind DH
4. Wells CF
5. Wallace !B
6. Snider Corner Outfield Spot
7. A real 3B
8. Catcher be it a vet like Buck again or young Archeiba and a vet platoon
9. A new SS: Gonzo for now, Hechy for the future.

McDonald, the other catcher, Bautista and maybe Ruiz again or McCoy on the bench.

Its not looking horrible, but with so many needs, 2012 may be the better bet to contend.

Or we beg for realignment lol.

By: DannyLeafs

DannyLeafs — Tue, 06 Apr 2010 04:42:46 +0000

That is exactly the reason that the Canadiens should hold on to Price for the time being. With the market for goalies being the way it is right now they stand no chance of getting close to that for him.

I think the best they could hope for at this time is Gagne in a straight up deal.

By: bbruins37

bbruins37 — Tue, 06 Apr 2010 00:11:06 +0000

Yeah the last I heard about Hechavarria was that visa issues are holding it up, but it's a done-deal otherwise. It was pretty surprising that the Jays outbid them, it looked like the Yankees were really close to signing him.

The bullpen is a nightmare right now. I guess because the starters are good and deep you could groom one or both of Jenkins and Stewart into closers. I'd like to think that Jenkins in particular would become a starter up here someday though.

Who do you think has ace-potential outside of Drabek though? There's alot of good pitchers, but I can't see any turning into aces except maybe Drabek, and that's a big maybe.

Bautista batting first is a joke. I think 2-4 could be really good if Wells performs even somewhat close to what he did before getting his contract. The rest is...not great. Snider was sick a couple years ago in limited action, but he was pretty bad last year. He shouldn't be 9th though. He's only like 21 or something right?

SS is definitely still a need. Gonzalez? I'd prefer to bite the bullet on Johnny Mac's awful bat and keep him in for his defensive ability alone. From what I know about Gonzalez he isn't that much better at bat, and is supposed to be good defensively. Big upgrade...