Comments on: Ryan-for-Kaberle trade? Really?

By: mojo19

mojo19 — Mon, 14 Jun 2010 12:41:36 +0000

Switch Kenny Ryan with a different prospect. I like that kid. When they asked who his favourite player was growing up he answered "Darren McCarty" lol

By: mojo19

mojo19 — Sun, 13 Jun 2010 22:45:20 +0000

Nice comment. I think I would take Caputi, based on what I've seen from him, right now over Stalberg and Hanson. Kadri I won't comment on, and Kulemin is the best of the bunch.

someone made an intersting comparison of Stalberg and Jonas Hoglund. Big guy, decent hands, but just a perimeter player, a guy who looks like he has the tools to post 50-60 points but only puts up 30. I know they're not exactly the same, Hoglund had that heavy, deadly wrist shot that basically kept him around on Mats' line, and Stalberg has that breakaway speed, but there is definitely a comparison to be made.

So I'm not sold on Stalberg yet, I actually prefer Freddy Sjostrom.

By: cam7777

cam7777 — Sun, 13 Jun 2010 21:51:41 +0000

Not true at all. Beauchemin was signed days after the free agent frenzy, long after Cammalleri was a Hab. Cammalleri signed with Montreal on July 1st, Grabovski was signed the next day, and Beauchemin was signed a few days later. Cammalleri would have been nice, in hindsight, but 6 million is a lot of money for him. It looks like he would have been worth it right now, but it was not so crystal clear last year. Remember, Cammalleri has had a history of having radically different performances year in and year out. Burke was willing to pay 5, and Gainey was willing to pay 6.

As for the original discusion. If the deal for Ryan went through, I would look to sign a 2nd tier forward, keep Grabovski, and maybe make a push for David Clarkson. Also, if it's true that Kyle Beach is on the table if someone is willing to take on Huet or Campbell, I would jump on that:

To Chicago:

Jeff Finger
Kenny Ryan

To Toronto:

Cristobal Huet
Kyle Beach

-Cristobal Huet borrowed to a European club.

To New Jersey:

Jimmy Hayes
John Mitchell
5th in 2010 (NJD)

To Toronto:

David Clarkson

-Clarkson extended 3 years, 7.5 million

-sign Alexander Frolov, 1 year, 4.5 million
-sign Matt Cooke, 3 years, 5.625 million

alexander frolov (4.5) - tyler bozak (3.725) - phil kessel (5.4)
viktor stalberg (0.85) - nazem kadri (1.75) - bobby ryan (5.0)
nikolai kulemin (2.2) - m. grabovski (2.9) - dave clarkson (2.5)
matt cooke (1.875) - todd marchant (1.125) - colton orr (1.0)

fred sjostrom (0.75), christian hanson (0.9)

dion phaneuf 'C' (6.5) - luke schenn (2.975)
carl gunnarsson (0.8) - francois beauchemin (3.8)
mike komisarek (4.5) - mike vanryn (0.75)

phil oreskovic (0.525)

jonas gustavsson (1.35) - j.s. giguere (6.0)

I think Grabovski could really make himself valuable on this team if we give him another shot. He was so much better when he returned from injury last year, even with less experienced linemates. He has chemistry with Kulemin, and putting someone like Clarkson with these two could be money in the bank.

Frolov is looking for 5 million on a multi-year deal, but he's coming off a very weak performance last year. Burke could try to sell him on a 1 year deal show-casing himself in the biggest market in the hockey world. "come here alex, play on our top line, get all the attention - if we like you here, we'll give you the money you're looking for longer term, or trade you to a contender at the deadline." We already know Kessel and Bozak have mad chemistry, so putting a big bodied Frolov with them would be a solid add on. It's no Marleau, but it's pretty good.

I really like this lineup because pretty much everyone is going to have to fight tooth and nail for their ice-time save for Kessel, Bozak and Ryan. If Frolov is slacking, Stalberg or Kulemin can take his place. If anyone in the bottom six is slacking, Hanson, Sjostrom, Caputi and Irwin are goin to be pushing for spots. Even all the younger guys (Stalberg, Caputi, Hanson), could see guys like Paradis, DiDomenico, Beach (although if we actually landed Beach, I would try to swap him for a disgrunted Canuck prospect, ahem), and Stefanovich push for their spots. VanRyn and Oreskovic are given the benefit of the doubt, but Holzer, Mikus and Aulie will be looking on constantly. Hell, even Giguere has to be careful late in the year, or we'll just bring back Huet, or call up Scrivens or Rynnas.

One more year of question marks, and by next summer, we'll truly see Burke's team.

By: Kev_Leafs

Kev_Leafs — Sun, 13 Jun 2010 21:31:17 +0000

I'd love it if Burke ends up swinging a deal even remotely this good for Kaberle. I'm worried we're going to end up with a couple 2nd rounders or some decent 3rd liner and a pick.

I'd be ecstatic over getting Neal, let alone Ryan.

Gotta love Whitby boys. Nieuwendyk, Roberts, the Primeaus, Foote, Neal, Ranger.

If Kaberle is gone and Van Ryn is a no-go, I'm all for trying to steal Ranger from Tampa for next to nothing (a sixth rounder?) - under the pretences of 'letting him play close to home might do him some good'. Maybe Stevie will bite.

I was raised in Whitby and am totally biased.

By: cam7777

cam7777 — Sun, 13 Jun 2010 17:44:50 +0000

Kulemin is asking for 2.7 million. Some people think he's deserving of that. Like I keep saying whenever this is brought up, you don't think that Pittsburgh or Detroit woudl rather have a 2.7 million dollar Kulemin than a late 1st and a late 3rd in the weakest draft in a decade (2011)? Of course they'd rather have Kulemin you brainless toad. Picks that late have less than a 50% chance of making the NHL (probably closer to 30%), and they take years to develop. Cup ready teams don't give a shit about late picks.

By: leafmeister

leafmeister — Sun, 13 Jun 2010 15:57:52 +0000

Yeah. Getting a future 40 goal, possibly 50 goal sniper who is a proven NHL commodity is really "throwing away" draft picks. Did he overpay? Probably. Is it totally decided yet? Absolutely not. Either way, the Leafs have Kessel, and he is a very valuable asset.

By: 24_cups_and_counting

24_cups_and_counting — Sun, 13 Jun 2010 15:42:39 +0000

Not sure why you keep thinking that your gonna get a 1st and 3rd for Kulemin. Everybody and there brother knows that the Leafs and Kulemin are in a contract battle. Burke has publicly stated that Kulemin is asking for the sun, moon and the stars with this contract.

The only way Burke gets a 1st round pick for a contract holdout is by trading with himself. He seems to be the only one that throws 1st round picks away for contract problem players who are asking more than they're worth.

By: leafit2me

leafit2me — Sun, 13 Jun 2010 02:19:25 +0000

I can live with that.

I still don't think we need to pursue an Armstrong. I would rather we traded Grabo for the highest pick we can get (hopefully the 2nd we gave up for him) and use the cap savings from that and an Armstrong signing to get a #1 center like a Marleau.

We made that mistake last year when BB extended Grabo for $2.9M and then went out and signed 2 similar-ish style defenseman in Beach and Komi. Had we only signed one of them and not extended Grabo we might have been able to sign Cammaleri who was in the building that morning.

By: cam7777

cam7777 — Sun, 13 Jun 2010 01:54:27 +0000

I think it's entirely possible that Ryan becomes a Leaf for much less than people are anticipating. It's pretty hysterical if you think Kadri or Schenn are going to Anaheim. Maybe if Ryan had two years left on his entry-level deal, but the fact is, Anaheim doesn't have that kind of leverage right now. I said this a while back, but perhaps Anaheim will look for a winger in their price range, and an additional add on if they deal Ryan. A three-way trade that works for everyone:

To Anaheim:

James Neal
2nd in 2011 (tor)

To Dallas:

Tomas Kaberle
James Reimer

To Toronto:

Bobby Ryan
Todd Marchant

Anaheim dumps 1.125 million by moving out Marchant (this is actually helping them out quite a bit given their wealth of affordable 4th line, AHL talent, and lack of financial stability). They trade Ryan (seeking upwards of 5 million) for Neal (seeking about 4 million), which is not a massive downgrade, but obviously more in their price range. They also land a high pick for next year's draft. Compared to an offer-sheet, this is a sweetheart offer.

Dallas moves the winger they can't afford to resign for the puck-mover they desperately crave. Presumably this would leave them shopping Ribeiro to get under their self-imposed cap, but otherwise intact. Benn and Glennie can easily cover the lost ice-time of Neal, and at a quarter of the cost. Also, Dallas has long been in the market for a young goalie prospect. They lost out on Gustavsson, Rynnas and Scrivens, but Reimer is available, and ahead of the latter two on the depth chart.

The Leafs move a star defensemen, a prospect, and a pick, and take back a young star, and a useless (to Anaheim) contract. Again, if Ryan is forcing his way to July 1st, which it looks like he is, than this is better than the 1st, 2nd and 3rd they'd get in the 2011 draft if someone gets the oppurtunity to front-load an offer-sheet and price the ducks out. Also, you have to think Murray doesn't think as highly of Ryan as many of the fans on these websites do. After all, the man started negotiations at 3 million, and is unwilling to go above 4.5. It doesn't sound to me like he feels Ryan is as integral as fans like to think. And to be fair, the Ducks do have Getzlaf, Perry, Lupul, Selanne, and Blake - which is a decent scoring group - as well as Holland, Beleskey, Palmieri, and others coming up, plus two selections in the first round this year (probably a Granlund or Niedderreiter, and maybe even a Kabanov). So it's not as though Ryan's goals are irreplaceable. Neal himself scored only 8 fewer than Ryan this year...

By: leafit2me

leafit2me — Sun, 13 Jun 2010 01:53:06 +0000

RE Kadri & Caputi:

1. Yes he will have to prove himself in camp. The thing I fear is that Wilson and Burke might give him more leeway than he deserves because they need him to crack the lineup to make things work capwise which may or may not be in his best interest in terms of player development. Funny how the business side of the game can be ruthless in that regard.

2. The other thing that worries me is their attitudes. I'm not saying that they have bad attitude (ala Kassian or Grabovski) but I just think the age factor and the fact that both would be playing in front of hometown fans everyday, not to mention the Toronto media that would be all over Kadri's every step....I just don't think thats a good thing.

3. Caputi's minutes last season dropped steadily after his first few games as a TML. I dont think that sitting for 45-50 mins of the game helps with player development and right now I dont think that there is spot for him on the top 6 ahead of Stalberg, Hansen, Kadri and Kulemin.